Discussion:
diagram of how refill solenoid valve works
(too old to reply)
Robert Harmon
2009-11-16 19:06:58 UTC
Permalink
http://tinyurl.com/how-2-way-solenoid-valve-works

This is what the refill solenoid valve looks like internally. If you
hook it up backwards water pressure can push the piston/plunger off
the valve seat, letting water flow uninterrupted to the boiler.

Tex
Xoltx
2009-11-16 19:50:42 UTC
Permalink
Post by Robert Harmon
http://tinyurl.com/how-2-way-solenoid-valve-works
This is what the refill solenoid valve looks like internally. If you
hook it up backwards water pressure can push the piston/plunger off
the valve seat, letting water flow uninterrupted to the boiler.
Tex
and harmon,knows how too hook 'em up backwards!!LOL
Mary Alan
2009-11-16 21:38:35 UTC
Permalink
Post by Robert Harmon
http://tinyurl.com/how-2-way-solenoid-valve-works
This is what the refill solenoid valve looks like
internally. If you
hook it up backwards water pressure can push the
piston/plunger off
the valve seat, letting water flow uninterrupted to
the boiler.
Tex
and harmon,knows how too hook 'em up backwards!!LOL
Blain when you stated that "the Reneka is an HX
machine, I looked it up"

Where exactly did you look it up?
***** Inquiring minds want to know!!! *****

Sheer genius LOL.
Barry Jarrett
2009-11-18 07:24:29 UTC
Permalink
On Mon, 16 Nov 2009 11:06:58 -0800 (PST), Robert Harmon
Post by Robert Harmon
http://tinyurl.com/how-2-way-solenoid-valve-works
This is what the refill solenoid valve looks like internally. If you
hook it up backwards water pressure can push the piston/plunger off
the valve seat, letting water flow uninterrupted to the boiler.
well, that depends upon the pressure differential, doesn't it?
Tex
2009-11-18 17:03:53 UTC
Permalink
Post by Barry Jarrett
On Mon, 16 Nov 2009 11:06:58 -0800 (PST), Robert Harmon
 >http://tinyurl.com/how-2-way-solenoid-valve-works
 >
 >This is what the refill solenoid valve looks like internally. If you
 >hook it up backwards water pressure can push the piston/plunger off
 >the valve seat, letting water flow uninterrupted to the boiler.
well, that depends upon the pressure differential, doesn't it?
Hi Barry,
The 3 machines I have all use one-way valves after the refill
solenoid, so there's no pressure when the valve is closed. The spring
that holds the piston against the seat is weak (2 - 5 lbs for my
machines) so it can't resist the 30 psi line pressure. And if
someone's running their machine w/o a pressure reducer the line
pressure around here would be 60+ psi.

Tex
Tex
2009-11-18 17:36:55 UTC
Permalink
Post by Barry Jarrett
On Mon, 16 Nov 2009 11:06:58 -0800 (PST), Robert Harmon
 >http://tinyurl.com/how-2-way-solenoid-valve-works
 >
 >This is what the refill solenoid valve looks like internally. If you
 >hook it up backwards water pressure can push the piston/plunger off
 >the valve seat, letting water flow uninterrupted to the boiler.
well, that depends upon the pressure differential, doesn't it?
OK, I think I see what you meant. This is ONLY a problem when the
boiler is cold. After it heats up to 250 degrees the boiler pressure
would stop the flow of water. Good point!

Tex
Barry Jarrett
2009-11-24 08:42:23 UTC
Permalink
On Mon, 16 Nov 2009 11:06:58 -0800 (PST), Robert Harmon
Post by Robert Harmon
http://tinyurl.com/how-2-way-solenoid-valve-works
This is what the refill solenoid valve looks like internally. If you
hook it up backwards water pressure can push the piston/plunger off
the valve seat, letting water flow uninterrupted to the boiler.
Tex
btw, tex, that valve is labelled incorrectly. you have the inlet and
outlets reversed.
Xoltx
2009-11-24 10:34:25 UTC
Permalink
Post by Barry Jarrett
On Mon, 16 Nov 2009 11:06:58 -0800 (PST), Robert Harmon
 >http://tinyurl.com/how-2-way-solenoid-valve-works
 >
 >This is what the refill solenoid valve looks like internally. If you
 >hook it up backwards water pressure can push the piston/plunger off
 >the valve seat, letting water flow uninterrupted to the boiler.
 >
 >Tex
btw, tex, that valve is labelled incorrectly.  you have the inlet and
outlets reversed.
lol!
Tex
2009-11-24 15:57:05 UTC
Permalink
Nope Barry - that diagram is correctly marked. The port leading from the
valve seat is always the outlet (per the manufacturers literature).
--
Robert (Tex) Harmon

http://tinyurl.com/mb4uj - My coffee pages.
http://tinyurl.com/2j8jur - Gaggia User's Group
http://tinyurl.com/235dfr - BUG is Bunn User's Group (espresso)
Post by Barry Jarrett
On Mon, 16 Nov 2009 11:06:58 -0800 (PST), Robert Harmon
Post by Robert Harmon
http://tinyurl.com/how-2-way-solenoid-valve-works
This is what the refill solenoid valve looks like internally. If you
hook it up backwards water pressure can push the piston/plunger off
the valve seat, letting water flow uninterrupted to the boiler.
Tex
btw, tex, that valve is labelled incorrectly. you have the inlet and
outlets reversed.
Xoltx
2009-11-24 16:54:17 UTC
Permalink
WGAF, really???
XoltX
2009-11-24 18:06:13 UTC
Permalink
Post by Xoltx
WGAF, really???
As he's asking the stupidest question imaginable, good ol' Spanky doesn't
realize he's answered his own question in kind. Hey Dave, when you were in
elementary school did the other kids tease you and call you Dave brain-dead
Blane? Did you used to get your 'gang' to chase them home after school?

LOL
Jamie
Xoltx
2009-11-24 21:14:36 UTC
Permalink
Post by XoltX
As he's asking the stupidest question imaginable, good ol' Spanky doesn't
realize he's answered his own question in kind. Hey Dave, when you were in
elementary school did the other kids tease you and call you Dave brain-dead
Blane? Did you used to get your 'gang' to chase them home after school?
LOL
Jamie
amazing.
shane
2009-11-25 14:17:25 UTC
Permalink
Post by Tex
Nope Barry - that diagram is correctly marked. The port leading from the
valve seat is always the outlet (per the manufacturers literature).
--
Robert (Tex) Harmon
I am curious, what manufacturer are you talking about? The espresso
machine or the valve manufacterer?

Shane
Barry Jarrett
2009-11-25 07:25:51 UTC
Permalink
so, let's follow the water path on your diagram: the water comes in
the port you have labeled as "inlet" and passes into the chamber with
the piston and then shooting out the vent orifice, because, after all,
this is a diagram of a 3-way solenoid and not a 2-way solenoid.

the way you have the illustration labeled is just the way that
Marzocco recommends installing their boiler fill valve (which is a
3-way with the vent orifice capped off), and reverse of the "normal"
orientation for a 3-way brew valve (which is to have the water coming
in the port you have labeled "outlet").
Tex
2009-11-25 15:19:15 UTC
Permalink
Asco Red Hat

Water comes into the valve and remains in the chambers as long as the spring
is pressing the piston against the valve seat. When the magnet lifts the
piston, water can flow out of the valve. If it is reversed, line pressure
can lift the piston off the valve seat, causing the valve to leak.

This image has no vent - it is a 2-way valve. The cylinder for the piston is
a sealed unit - water flows from the inlet port to the outlet only.
--
Robert (Tex) Harmon

http://tinyurl.com/mb4uj - My coffee pages.
http://tinyurl.com/2j8jur - Gaggia User's Group
http://tinyurl.com/235dfr - BUG is Bunn User's Group (espresso)
Post by Barry Jarrett
so, let's follow the water path on your diagram: the water comes in
the port you have labeled as "inlet" and passes into the chamber with
the piston and then shooting out the vent orifice, because, after all,
this is a diagram of a 3-way solenoid and not a 2-way solenoid.
the way you have the illustration labeled is just the way that
Marzocco recommends installing their boiler fill valve (which is a
3-way with the vent orifice capped off), and reverse of the "normal"
orientation for a 3-way brew valve (which is to have the water coming
in the port you have labeled "outlet").
alan
2009-11-25 17:39:12 UTC
Permalink
Post by Tex
[...]
This image has no vent - it is a 2-way valve. The cylinder for the piston
is a sealed unit - water flows from the inlet port to the outlet only.
--
Robert (Tex) Harmon
Sure looks like a 3-way valve to me. For a comparison of 2-way and 3-way
valves, have a look at:
http://www.omega.com/TechRef/techprinc.html
In fact, the image on that page showing a 3-way valve looks exactly like the
image you've labelled as 2-way . . .
Post by Tex
Post by Barry Jarrett
so, let's follow the water path on your diagram: the water comes in
the port you have labeled as "inlet" and passes into the chamber with
the piston and then shooting out the vent orifice, because, after all,
this is a diagram of a 3-way solenoid and not a 2-way solenoid.
the way you have the illustration labeled is just the way that
Marzocco recommends installing their boiler fill valve (which is a
3-way with the vent orifice capped off), and reverse of the "normal"
orientation for a 3-way brew valve (which is to have the water coming
in the port you have labeled "outlet").
alan
2009-11-25 18:28:56 UTC
Permalink
Post by alan
Post by Tex
[...]
This image has no vent - it is a 2-way valve. The cylinder for the piston
is a sealed unit - water flows from the inlet port to the outlet only.
--
Robert (Tex) Harmon
Sure looks like a 3-way valve to me. For a comparison of 2-way and 3-way
http://www.omega.com/TechRef/techprinc.html
In fact, the image on that page showing a 3-way valve looks exactly like
the image you've labelled as 2-way . . .
Ah . . . I see you've corrected your image ;-)
Tex
2009-11-25 16:31:57 UTC
Permalink
For clarification purposes, here's a link that details how a 2-way valve
works.

http://www.hydraulicspneumatics.com/200/eBooks/Article/True/45152/
--
Robert (Tex) Harmon

http://tinyurl.com/mb4uj - My coffee pages.
http://tinyurl.com/2j8jur - Gaggia User's Group
http://tinyurl.com/235dfr - BUG is Bunn User's Group (espresso)
Post by Tex
Asco Red Hat
Water comes into the valve and remains in the chambers as long as the
spring is pressing the piston against the valve seat. When the magnet
lifts the piston, water can flow out of the valve. If it is reversed, line
pressure can lift the piston off the valve seat, causing the valve to
leak.
This image has no vent - it is a 2-way valve. The cylinder for the piston
is a sealed unit - water flows from the inlet port to the outlet only.
--
Robert (Tex) Harmon
http://tinyurl.com/mb4uj - My coffee pages.
http://tinyurl.com/2j8jur - Gaggia User's Group
http://tinyurl.com/235dfr - BUG is Bunn User's Group (espresso)
Post by Barry Jarrett
so, let's follow the water path on your diagram: the water comes in
the port you have labeled as "inlet" and passes into the chamber with
the piston and then shooting out the vent orifice, because, after all,
this is a diagram of a 3-way solenoid and not a 2-way solenoid.
the way you have the illustration labeled is just the way that
Marzocco recommends installing their boiler fill valve (which is a
3-way with the vent orifice capped off), and reverse of the "normal"
orientation for a 3-way brew valve (which is to have the water coming
in the port you have labeled "outlet").
Barry Jarrett
2009-11-25 17:09:10 UTC
Permalink
1) the diagram is clearly a 3-way valve; it is obvious from the
illustrated water path, the presence of an upper (vent) valve seat and
corresponding face on the piston, the valve body extends well beyond
the coil and terminates in a relieved and chamfered end typically used
to receive a flare fitting;

2) such valves may be used as 2-way valves, and when used as such, the
illustrated orientation is correct. this is the configuration used on
marzocco lineas (and perhaps others).

3) the illustrated orientation is opposite that required for the valve
to function as a normal 3-way brew valve, and as the valve shown is a
3-way, it would normally have a flow arrow indication molded or
stamped on the housing, and that arrow would, in this case, be
pointing against the flow, for the reasons stated above.
Xoltx
2009-11-25 17:34:10 UTC
Permalink
Q: Why is harmon tex drek dishing this bullshit?
A; to get attention! duh!
bernie
2009-11-25 17:40:15 UTC
Permalink
Post by Barry Jarrett
1) the diagram is clearly a 3-way valve; it is obvious from the
illustrated water path, the presence of an upper (vent) valve seat and
corresponding face on the piston, the valve body extends well beyond
the coil and terminates in a relieved and chamfered end typically used
to receive a flare fitting;
2) such valves may be used as 2-way valves, and when used as such, the
illustrated orientation is correct. this is the configuration used on
marzocco lineas (and perhaps others).
3) the illustrated orientation is opposite that required for the valve
to function as a normal 3-way brew valve, and as the valve shown is a
3-way, it would normally have a flow arrow indication molded or
stamped on the housing, and that arrow would, in this case, be
pointing against the flow, for the reasons stated above.
Tex
2009-11-25 18:29:49 UTC
Permalink
Post by Robert Harmon
http://tinyurl.com/how-2-way-solenoid-valve-works
This is what the refill solenoid valve looks like internally. If you
hook it up backwards water pressure can push the piston/plunger off
the valve seat, letting water flow uninterrupted to the boiler.
Tex
That's why I put this out for review! I did have the images switched -
a 3-way valve was displayed. I corrected the images and reposted it.
Take a look now - I believe it's correct.

http://tinyurl.com/how-2-way-solenoid-valve-works

Thanks again for checking my work!
Tex
Seymour Beaver
2009-11-25 23:00:40 UTC
Permalink
I think it would be good if you checked your work
first texxy, then
you could claim to be a REAL AUTHORITY!!
Webster : Jealous
Adj
1. Intolerant of rivalry
2. Hostile toward a rival or one believed to enjoy an
advantage.
3.Snivels when relegated to dancing in the shadows

If someone could please reply to Davey's last 2
threads, he's a REAL AUTHORITY on Tex.
Xoltx
2009-11-25 18:33:16 UTC
Permalink
I think it would be good if you checked your work first texxy, then
you could claim to be a REAL AUTHORITY!!
Tex
2009-11-25 19:00:32 UTC
Permalink
Post by Xoltx
I think it would be good if you checked your work first texxy, then
you could claim to be a REAL AUTHORITY!!
I make mistakes now & then on purpose, just so I can better appreciate
how you feel bub!

LOL
Tex

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